Not Your Mama's Classroom: What You Need to Know As A Parent About Your Child's Digital Education

[00:01] Announcer:

Welcome to Principal Center Radio, helping you build capacity for instructional leadership. Here's your host, Director of the Principal Center, Dr. Justin Bader. Welcome everyone to Principal Center Radio.

[00:13] SPEAKER_02:

I'm your host, Justin Bader, and I'm honored to be joined today by Dr. Wendy Oliver. Wendy has more than 20 years of experience in online and blended education, serving as the chief learning architect for an online school through Arizona State University. And she's currently the chief learning officer at Edison Learning and the author of Not Your Mama's Classroom, What You Need to Know as a Parent About Your Child's Digital Education.

[00:39] Announcer:

And now, our feature presentation.

[00:41] SPEAKER_02:

Wendy, welcome to Principal Center Radio.

[00:43] SPEAKER_01:

Thank you. It's great to be here.

[00:45] SPEAKER_02:

Well, Wendy, let's start by talking about what is similar and what is different. And I think starting in about March 2020, parents everywhere started to have all new experiences with online and digital learning. But you've been in this space for a long time and have done a lot of thinking about learning

[01:05] SPEAKER_01:

what really makes digital education work so set that up for us if you would yeah absolutely you know what things i try to clarify for parents so that they don't get discouraged with what online education could or should look like is that we were all thrown into quote-unquote online education in march of 2020. it wasn't an option it wasn't a choice for teachers or for students or for parents Then you add to that the fact that parents were trying to work at home while they were trying to facilitate learning for their children. And that's not ideal for online learning. And I try to clarify that there is a significant difference between online learning and remote learning. And a lot of teachers had to, overnight, come up with online lesson plans and resources for students. And in a true online course, there are experts that specialize in creating materials in courses specifically designed for students that are working remotely, whether that be from home, whether that be because they're competitive gymnasts and they're traveling across the country.

[02:08]

And they're trained and taught how to create and design content specifically for that type of learning. teachers aren't taught how to design and create that type of curriculum. They're taught how to facilitate and how to really engage students and how to teach. And they're two very different things. So the first place I start with is, okay, first of all, let's talk about the difference between remote and online learning. And really, Online learning delivered well really comes down to pedagogy and what the teacher does from an instructional perspective.

[02:42]

Because that is one thing that isn't different. The teacher is always what makes it successful. And I don't think you can ever remove the teacher from a successful learning experience.

[02:52] SPEAKER_02:

Let's talk more about the pedagogy, because honestly, I'm surprised and delighted to hear you say that, because I think about online learning as being overwhelmingly about curriculum. It's almost like our perception, incorrectly I suppose, is that the teacher is almost removed from the equation, and we're just kind of directly giving students access to the curriculum. So what role does the teacher play? When we get this right and really think about what pedagogy looks like in an online setting, what role is the teacher playing beyond just, hey, I hope you do your work and here I graded your work. How can we go beyond that?

[03:27] SPEAKER_01:

So, you know, unfortunately, that's what a lot of people think. They think it's more of just a facilitator role. And sometimes in online learning programs, teachers are assigned an enormous number of students because in their model, that's all it is. It's just, let me crank out some grades and check the box because it's a cheaper model. And that's not really a quality program. I just worked actually with NSQ to rewrite the National Standards for Quality Instruction nationally.

[03:54]

I co-led the leadership for rewriting that initiative. And we rewrote those standards for instruction. And, you know, there's really a huge factor of engagement and engaging and interacting with students that's required. Really looking at their assessments, getting them involved in learner-to-learner interaction. getting them involved in learner to teacher interaction. You know, that's where I've really seen things change and grow over the years.

[04:22]

But that pedagogy is also involved, you know, to go back to what you said, it is also about curriculum. How is that curriculum designed so that the student is thinking at a higher level and relating the curriculum to his or her life? So as a teacher, I'm going to be reaching out to that student and helping that student make connections to the real world. And those are also things that parents can do. How can I help relate that curriculum to the real world as opposed to, you know, have my child go off of the computer for six hours a day and then come back and, okay, check the box, that's done. You know, those are some of the advantages of online learning is that it allows the parent to be more involved in what the child is doing on a daily basis.

[05:02] SPEAKER_02:

Well, Wendy, I know you've written the book primarily for parents, but I think this is an incredibly important perspective for educators to take in and understand. And certainly, as a result of the COVID-19 pandemic, many of us experienced for the first time online learning. by design or by necessity and whether well designed or not. What are some things about that parental role and that parental involvement that educators need to be aware of? Because, you know, often it's a little bit of a black box to us as educators. We don't really know what's happening between the parent and the student or kind of what the, you know, what the circumstances of that work that's being done are.

[05:44]

So help us understand the parent's role a bit more and what that can look like.

[05:48] SPEAKER_01:

yeah absolutely at the beginning of your question you mentioned that yes i did write the book for parents but it's incredibly helpful to educators one thing that i've been a little bit surprised about is anytime i do book talks for parents and there are educators in the room they have asked me to come back and do the same presentation for the teachers because the administrators and the teachers find that the information is so useful that they want to explore and spread that information to their staff as well What I find with parents, that the parents are most concerned about and where they lack the most knowledge about is Internet and digital safety. And that is where I end up spending most of my time when I'm talking with parents. The other areas that I cover in the book that I think are most valuable to parents on how they can be more involved and how they can get more knowledge around what's going on with their children are around how to communicate with a quote unquote digital teacher.

[06:43]

Right. That's very different than seeing a teacher drop off and pick up. You know, I give examples of that in the book. And talk through what does that look like? You know, one thing about online learning is you always have immediate access to your child's grades. And that's very different than in a traditional classroom.

[06:58]

You don't always know exactly what's due or what's missing. You can always see the directions for assignments, for example. And if that teacher is really strong, there's always visibility from the teacher that the parent can be involved in and see. And the teacher's communicating regularly. Being involved in all those components of the instruction really allows the parent to be in a much different role than in a traditional classroom. One of the things, too, that I would say, especially that, you know, we've noticed since the March 2020 pandemic, is sometimes I think parents expect teachers to be a little bit too perfect.

[07:35]

And now this gives parents the opportunity to look directly into a teacher's classroom. I think we have to be a little bit forgiving on that because online using technology for instruction and being online really is a new experience for some teachers and they do improve as they move forward. But you have to remember, you know, that's a little bit unnerving to have all these people peering into your classroom. And so I do think we have to be a little bit flexible as parents knowing that, okay, we're looking into their classrooms just as they're looking into our homes when they're doing live lessons.

[08:10] SPEAKER_02:

definitely a time to be patient and, you know, and understanding with one another, knowing that, you know, especially when teachers are working remotely, they are dealing with, you know, often their own families and their own, you know, multiple things going on at once. Well, let's talk, Wendy, about online safety a bit, because as educators, you know, we're used to walking around the what's on their screen and and you know using our our in-person presence to make sure that students are being safe online but obviously when students are working from home uh you know they may be unsupervised their parents may be at work or you know doing their own work in another room what are some factors that we need to keep in mind regarding online safety when it comes to online instruction there are a few things that i always like to mention when this comes up and i i certainly go in depth i spend a whole chapter on this in the book

[09:00] SPEAKER_01:

Because there are just so many things that people don't realize. And even I will tell you, I was surprised when I was researching for the book. And I have a young child at home, too. So I'm very conscientious of these things, even in my own home. You know, one thing is be cautious when you're going on to, quote unquote, free sites. That's one thing I would say.

[09:21]

Nothing is ever free, right? Data is a form of currency, right? So anytime anything is free, you always want to look at the license to see what type of data they're collecting about you, your address, your computer, how your child is responding to things. And also remember, teachers typically are not trained in this. And so because of that, they may be sending them to sites for practice because they're free and not realizing that they're collecting their data. So that is something that I always suggest to teachers.

[09:54]

I always suggest to parents. always read the terms and conditions in the privacy policy. You know, one thing that most people don't realize, and this isn't really just around your children's safety, this is around your own. When you get a wireless router, and this is just something that I suggest everyone checks, when you get a wireless router, it comes with a default password. That default password is the same for that brand of router for everybody. So that makes it very easy for people with ill intentions to get access to it.

[10:24]

And when they have access to it, that means that they have access to your wireless network, which also means the cameras on your computers and any other cameras that are on your wireless network. And that allows them to see into your home. That's how a lot of burglaries happen. But also remember, if your children are in your home, if they're playing games online, et cetera, someone gets into your wireless network, you know, they can be seen. And that's really scary. Some of the other things that people just don't think about it, and I see this on Facebook, for example, that tells you my age because I'm not on Instagram, but people have pictures of their children, and they have their children in their school uniforms.

[11:03]

Well, now I know what your child looks like. I know where your child goes to school. And if I really wanted to, I could pull that picture and pull the geographic location off of it if you haven't changed that setting on your camera, and I could tell exactly where you were when you took that picture. And so here's where that gets really scary. We know that in 2018, there were 900,000 children criminally mistreated. In 2018, there were 747 approximately registered sex offenders in the United States.

[11:35]

At any given moment, the FBI says there are 50,000 children. predators online at any moment one in five teenagers has received an unsolicited sexual exploitation and I want you to think about this that I always say I want people to think about is you're letting your kids play on their iPads in their bedrooms unsupervised of that one in five that I told you about one of those is told an adult that's crazy to me that's terribly scary especially as I have you know a child in my house One in 25 teenagers has received a sexual solicitation online where the predator tried to meet them in person. And I kid you not, I sat next to a gentleman on a flight and his son was a victim of that. And that made it so real to me where I met someone who had been through that. And that's why I always say, if your child is working online, make sure that he or she is working somewhere where you can see the monitor, where you can see the screen.

[12:36]

Don't give them complete freedom because they're kids. I don't care if they're 18. They're still kids. And there are people with ill intentions that disguise themselves as children that try to harm our kids. Anyway, I could go on and on on this topic because there's so much out there, which is why I devoted an entire chapter to it. And I was even surprised by some of the things I found when I was researching for the chapter.

[12:59]

So there are a lot of benefits to the Internet and online learning. But I think that we have to be well informed as parents and as educators. And I fall into both categories now. I just think we just have to be cautious and just as long as we are aware, then we can protect our children while they receive the benefits of technology.

[13:18] SPEAKER_02:

Let's talk a little bit, if we could, about the interaction between students and parents. We think often of the extremes of the parent who is basically doing the work for the kid on the one extreme and the parent who maybe even is not home. on the other extreme. Within that range, what's going on that educators need to understand in the interaction and involvement between parent and student when a student is engaged in online learning?

[13:47] SPEAKER_01:

I got tickled when you asked me that question because many times have I had conversations where the parent is doing the work for the student. And I've even had a parent that got to the point of frustration that said, I know what She didn't do such and such because I did it for her. Of course, at that moment, you think, OK, now what in the conversation? And of course, you suggest, well, perhaps the child should redo the work. So there are many strategies around academic integrity that teachers in the online environment can use. Most often, I suggest you have a conversation with that child at least once a week around the work to ensure that that child is actually doing the work.

[14:26]

And then, of course, you have, like you suggested, on the other hand, you have children who are completely unsupervised and are struggling to do the work because they have no one at home to help them. Again, the more the teachers communicate with those children, the more that they are going to be able to support them. And that is critical online. You know, if a child feels completely isolated and that it's just them and the computer, they don't feel like they're getting the experience of school. But if they have that rapport with the teacher and they feel like the teacher is communicating, which is a lot of work, trust me, it is, then they get a much...

[15:01]

higher, more quality experience. Depending on the type of curriculum or the program that they're using, they could have artificial intelligence built in. So for that child that is struggling, for example, they could be getting content referred to them based on their performance. And that is, of course, ideal. So I always use this example. Let's say if I keep making mistakes dividing fractions, then ideally, if the software is interactive, Ideally, I'm getting references to reteach me how to multiply fractions.

[15:35]

That's kind of in an ideal world. That's the type of curriculum that the child would be working with that doesn't have the support from home. But again, we don't all have that. We saw what happened in March of 2020 and teachers all of a sudden had to just start pulling whatever resources that they had. So, you know, engaged is truly defined. I'm going to geek out on you here with education.

[15:57]

But, you know, engagement is truly defined by the level of rigor. And by rigor, I don't mean hard. And that's how it's always misunderstood. You know, engagement is truly defined by those higher levels on Bloom's taxonomy and in webs. And I always use the Hess matrix when I'm evaluating curriculum. And you're looking for, are they applying?

[16:18]

Are they collaborating? Are they thinking creatively? And those things can be done if the student doesn't have the support at home. And then the instruction should be personalized and individualized because the technology allows that to happen. And ideally, the teacher should be able to have those individual conversations with the student whose parents at home and is the helicopter parent, much like I am. and is so involved in the day-to-day.

[16:50] SPEAKER_02:

So as we think about maybe the students who are physically out of our sight and maybe we are wondering how to engage with them, to keep them connected, what are some strategies that you've seen teachers use to stay in touch with students who maybe have a tendency to kind of disappear behind that laptop screen. If we get the feeling that maybe we're being ghosted by a student, that we're not seeing the work come in, we're not sure how often the student is checking in, and we know that that student does have internet access, what are some effective strategies for kind of building that bridge, reaching out, and figuring out how to best support the student remotely?

[17:31] SPEAKER_01:

There's obviously live lessons where not only are they groups through class, but also then breaking those down into smaller groups with friends. That encourages some students. They want to be online then so that they can see their friends and interact with them. Maybe if that only has two people in it. And it's set up as a quote unquote reteaching. I think that helps a lot of the social emotional things that children are going through and that encourages them to get online.

[17:59]

I have also seen, I'm sure you have too, where teachers are going by students' homes and, you know, just blowing the horn or standing on their front porch and making deliveries online. um, whatever that might be. And the children just light up, right. Or even administrators are doing that or car parades through neighborhoods. And, you know, I remember even as a child seeing a teacher in the grocery store and just that's strangeness because I didn't realize that teachers were normal, you know, teachers.

[18:33]

And so, you know, little things like that or sending postcards or notes, It really connects them back into their family and their communities, whereas they're not feeling that because they're feeling such isolation. Those have been some strategies that I have seen that I really think have made a big difference and they don't require that much effort.

[18:57] SPEAKER_02:

So the book is Not Your Mama's Classroom, What You Need to Know as a Parent About Your Child's Digital Education. And Wendy, if people want to learn more about your work or follow you online, where's the best place for them to find and connect with you?

[19:10] SPEAKER_00:

So they can go to DrWendyOliver.com or follow me on Twitter at Oliver underscore doctor.

[19:17] SPEAKER_02:

Wendy, thank you so much for joining me on Principal Center Radio.

[19:19] SPEAKER_00:

Thank you. I appreciate it.

[19:20] Announcer:

Thanks for listening to Principal Center Radio. For more great episodes, subscribe on our website at principalcenter.com slash radio.